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Dec 15 7:00 PM

4 attended (est.) – No rating yet

Enneagram and Relationships

Part One - Personality-Based Challenges to Intimacy

The topic of relationships as illuminated by the Enneagram is potentially a large one. It might be natural from a theoretical point of view to approach this topics with a map of how types interact in various kinds of relationships. (A few such books have appeared in the popular Enneagram literature.) Depending on interest levels in the group we may continue with further offerings in this area.

To begin with, we will approach the topic from the viewpoint of our own self-observations - in the arena of intimate relationships - specifically with regard to the patterns that challenge our self-expression in that arena - a topic to which we surely can all relate at least some of the time.

Please read the eight page excerpt on various kinds of challenges from a book by relationship therapist Mark Lillibridge. (Members can find this excerpt by using the "Files" button at upper-left of this page.) Lillibridge maps out three basic self-defeating patterns - which cover a surprisingly large amount of ground, somewhat like the basic motivation- and behavior-patterns described by the Enneagram.

We will go over these patterns and discuss how we may all have played one or more of the roles described at various times. It will be interesting to ask how closely our Enneagram type influences the roles we fall into in relationship.

Please come prepared to delve into your own personal life in an open and supportive environment. Our focus will be on self-observation - so that while you may wish to share background information about others in your life (obviously personal information is generally best left anonymous), the point of this information will be to share our own processes of self-awareness and growth in relationship. In other words, the main point should not be the particular qualities of the persons you have attracted into your life - but rather exactly how you have related and are relating with these persons.

Le Pain Quotidien
New York, NY, 10003

5 Yes
5 Maybe

Nov 4 7:00 PM

7 attended (est.) – 3.00 3.001

CG Jung on Typology versus Caricature

In Psychological Types (1921) Jung writes of an earlier writer's description of "the extraverted man":

"Intellectual criticism cannot help proceeding analytically and bringing the observed type to full clarity by pinning down its motives and aims. But this ... results in a picture that amounts to a caricature of the psychology of the extravert, and anyone who believes he has found the right attitude to an extravert on the basis of such a description would be astonished to see how the actual personality turns the description into a mockery....He does not see the positive man, but only his shadow . And the shadow proves the judgment right at the expense of the conscious, positive man."

Later in his book, Jung provides a general description of eight personality types in a chapter that went on to become influential, leading to the Myers-Briggs system of personality theory, as well as the socionics system.

We will discuss two of the briefer of Jung's descriptions. Some basic theory pointers will be provided to help link Jung's ideas with the modern Enneagram. Our focus will not be on theory for this session, however, but rather on Jung's attitude toward the types he paints - and, by extension, toward typology as an endeavor.

Presumably (based on quote above) Jung wanted to present a more balanced typology than the author he was quoting - that is, he wanted to present human beings fairly - with strengths and imperfections (or, put differently, potential for positive and negative development) - presented in such a way as to do descriptive justice to humanity.

The portraits that result seem to present a kind of pyramid in which positive human development is not necessarily excluded - but with increasing attention and descriptive detail Jung's narrative points to negative spirals into which some people are purported to fall.

We will discuss Jung's attitude and how it relates to attitudes surrounding the use of the Enneagram in our times.

Advance Reading

I have posted two brief excerpts from Psychological Types as pdf files (approx. 5-6 printed pages in total). To access these excerpts press the "Files" button - next-to-last button on the menu-sidebar at the upper-left of this page.

Please read if you can. My apologies for the bad copies - will try to have better ones at the meeting.

Only members of this Group can view the location for this Meetup

8 Yes
0 Maybe

Oct 7 7:00 PM

3 attended (est.) – No rating yet

Holy Ideas - Part II

We will delve more deeply into the Holy Ideas as presented by AH Almaas in his book Facets of Unity (Shambala, 2002). Last month, we examined an overview of four Enneagrams presented by Ichazo that were foundational for the modern Enneagram of Personality - the Enneagrams of Virtue, Passion, Holy Ideas and Fixation. Of these, the Holy Ideas are perhaps the most elusive in the subtlety of their conception.

While other popular Enneagram authors (e.g., Riso/Hudson, Palmer) present the Ichazo material in summary form, they appear content to outline the Holy Ideas in a rather terse descriptive fashion. Almaas seems unique among well-known Enneagram authors on the scene today in making a serious attempt to elucidate the meaning of the Holy Ideas in a descriptive form that goes well beyond an appeal to the words used by Ichazo, including a more felt description of what it is like to attain the perspective implied by these ideas.

We will go over Almaas' ideas in summary form - appealing to passages in his book as well as to notes made from his address to the 2005 IEA Conference. We will plan to focus as a group on selected Holy Ideas - pehaps two of the nine - and attempt to reach a consensus about the usefulness and clarity of Almaas' presentation.

We will also go over some tentative dates communicated by the Gurdjieff Foundation of NY for presentations of theirs in which some of our members may wish to participate.

Le Pain Quotidien
New York, NY, 10003

4 Yes
3 Maybe

Sep 15 7:00 PM

5 attended (est.) – 4.00 4.001

Ichazo's Enneagrams of Virtues, Passions, Holy Ideas and Fixations

This month we will go back to the beginning of the modern history of the Enneagram with an overview discussion of some of the basic source material from which contemporary Enneagram literature derives. This material was discussed in group form by Oscar Ichazo and was published in various forms during the 1970's.

The principle four basic "Enneagrams" that lead to the modern Enneagram of personality (out of many more Enneagrams - or Enneagons - used by Ichazo groups) are those of the Virtues, Passions, Holy Ideas and Fixations.

These four qualities all relate to individuals' relation to qualities of Essence or essential nature - and to the potential blocks and barriers that arise in characteristic ways between individuals and Essence. The qualities of Essence are both supremely simple and yet also paradoxically subtle, perhaps too much so for ordinary language.

We will explore on an overview basis our collective understanding of the non-dual Essence qualities as described in the terms used by Ichazo and in developments via other authors (notably Almaas). We will also discuss whether the group wishes to explore any of these fundamental aspects of the Enneagram in greater depth.

Some more preliminary reading may be found at the following link: http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/history.asp

Le Pain Quotidien
New York, NY, 10003

5 Yes
4 Maybe

Sep 1 7:45 PM

No rating yet

Focussing in on Type Nine

The Enneagram literature points to two main salient characteristics in defining Type Nine: a social style of relating that strongly emphasizes interpersonal harmony, peacefulness and "merging" (with another person or with experience itself) - and an inner life given to dreaminess and dissociation, in which pleasant fantasies may easily dominate, while disliked realities may be readily dismissed or forgotten.

Perhaps the first characteristic is easiest to use to identify persons of this type - as the "peaceful" social style of the Nine often leads them into relationships in which they play the subordinate or "supporter" role. While they certainly have no monopoly on this role (for example, persons of Type Six commonly play the "buddy" role as well - particularly with allies seen as more powerful than themselves), the overall pattern of self-effacing supportiveness that Nines tend to show can in many cases be recognized clearly enough from the outside.

And yet, the Enneagram literature tells us that things are not so simple as all that, for when Nines' patterns of relating at a more intimate level are described, there emerges a subtle willnulness and anger that typically remains "below the surface" (i.e., is only rarely expressed openly and directly) but that infuses their relationships with an added complication - the "selfless supporter" is often, perhaps typically, more in charge than he seems. There tends to be focus on the other person - which can be quite genuine and compassionate, but can also conceal (from the other and from the Nine themself) the intensity and focus the Nine brings to choices in the relationship. Thus, while Nines may typically show such patterns as self-abandonment at moments of decisions ("I don't care - you decide"), when they are probed with appropriate questioning, Nines will generally admit to caring deeply about something ... and often having a deep reluctance to bring that something into view.

This complexity of relating - overtly subordinate, subtly assertive - means among other things that Nines can be difficult to type using the Enneagram. Type Nine may indeed be described as the "sink" of the Enneagram, in that when someone can't identify with any other type they may eventually say, "I simply can't decide - I must be a Nine!" While they in some cases may be correct in this inference - Nines are given to indecision - a typing based on a blocked state rather than a positive inuition of some motivational quality would seem to leave more room for doubt. Indeed, Nines topped the list of the commonly-mistypes (redacted from the literature and distributed at our last meeting).

At this meeting, we will discuss the complexities of Type Nine in somewhat more detail - using examples of public personallities and perhaps joint contributions from those present from their own lives. We will focus at first on the complexities arising directly from the notion of Type Nine as a unitary grouping from the Enneagram literature.

We will aslo use this evening as a springboard to introduce an implication of a theory of the Enneagram developed by Nicholas (group co-organizer) that builds on the Enneagram in some ways, but differs from the conventinoal system in several respects - perhaps most notably, in which Type Nine (but not any of the other types) breaks into two quite seprate types. These types each share part of the complex definition of Nne as described above.

This new theory will be described (not in full detail, as that will require more time) but in its implication about these "two Nines" - how these types differ, how they may be distinguished among real persons, well-known examples of each of these two putative types, and so on.

We will adapt our discussion depending on group-attendance - if more Enneagram-beginners are present, we will focus more on our understanding of the Nine as an overall (single) type; if we have more regulars (or new participants with some background in studying the Enneagram), we will move more deeply into the new theory of the "two Nines".

As usual, there will be a more formal presentation (by Nicholas), with time allowed for group discussion and question and answer as needed.

Only members of this Group can view the location for this Meetup

0 Yes
0 Maybe

Aug 10 7:00 PM

8 attended (est.) – No rating yet

Type Wings

This month, we will discuss theories of "wings" -- variants of each type that can considerably vary the ways fundamental motivations show up in our lives, as well as how the ways our patterns may be recognizable from the outside.

The usual theory of wings in the Enneagram literature is due to Claudio Naranjo and stipulates that the nine conventional Enneagram types have wings on each side of the type -- for example, an individual Type 7 could have one of two possible neighboring wings (6 or 8), under this theory. Someone's type-wing could be relatively strong or weak, so that someone with no discernible wing at all could be said to be a "pure" example of a given core type. An abbreviated notation-style commonly used to describe (for example) an individual of Type 7 with a wing in Type 6 would be "7w6".

I (Nicholas) have been for the past year communicating to our group an alternative theory of Type-Wings, differing from the Naranjo theory. Most of the possible type-wings (with a few exceptions, which overlap with the Naranjo theory) are different under this newer theory. We will go over the new theory briefly and discuss how it may or may not relate to individuals in the group.

We will broaden our discussion to inquire more broadly into what Type-Wings may mean more precisely in the first place - and what the existence of strong variants within each type says about the Enneagram as a whole.

W will also discuss various upcoming potential topics for the autumn, potentially including more bridge-building with other systems and schools.

Note on Location
Due to scheduling conflicts, E-W Books will not be able to accommodate us for the dates we picked last time for our August and September meetings. After looking round the neighborhood, I stopped into the Union Sq branch of the Pain Quotidien cafe, which seemed quiet and suitable. They've agreed to host our meetup - there'll be no admission charge or minimum purchase (though I would encourage everyone to buy at least a cold drink or something). Their kitchen will close at 8.30 but we can stay til 9, after which we can go to the park if we want to go longer and the weather permits.

Only members of this Group can view the location for this Meetup

8 Yes
6 Maybe

Jul 1 7:00 PM

9 attended (est.) – No rating yet

Typing our Parents: Enneagram and Family-Structures

One of the uses that many people interested in the Enneagram seem consistently to engage with is how it applies to our important family-relationships and to the life-long consequences of those relationships for us as individuals.

If our parents are the most important people in the world for us to accept and also for us to forgive, then an important aspect of how we use a typing system like the Enneagram is how it applies to these and other basic figures in our lives.

Some of the literature on the Enneagram also suggests that people of different types may have typically different fundamental relationships to parent (or parent-figures) -- e.g., ambivalence with the mother (or nurturing-figure), frustration with the father (or protector-figure), etc.

We will go over basic theory and briefly introduce some new theoretical ideas about different basic structures of pairs and triplets of Enneagram-types, but also plan to leave time for sharing of personal perspectives and stories, as members feel motivated.

If you would like to share, it may be useful to consider in advance -- how do your basic family-relationships shape who you are now? Can you discern ways in which your on-going processes have been shaped in such a clear way that the rest of us (who most likely don't know your family) may be able to experience and feel these effects -- as well as hear about them from a distance.

As a reminder, East-West books charges a $5 admission fee for groups to use their cafe, exclusive of food and drink purchased there. No outside food or drink is allowed.

East West Books
New York, NY, 10011

9 Yes
4 Maybe

Jun 3 7:00 PM

7 attended (est.) – 4.00 4.004

We will continue our exploration of the synergies between the Enneagram and other related systems. Last month, we heard from Nicholas about relations with Ichazo instinct-types, MBTI and Wilber's system. Kirk presented his views on relations with astrology.

This month, we will plan to probe somewhat more deeply into the "instinctual subtypes" provided by the Enneagram as combined with Ichazo's three types of "instincts". The goal will be a more interactive discussion in which those who are comfortably solid with their Enneagram Type will be invited to explore possible sub-types according to this addendum to the system. There will be a short presentation followed by more open discussion.

(If the preponderance of attendees are beginners not completely comfortable or secure about their regular Enneagram type, we may default to a discussion of strategies for discovery of overall Enneagram-type. In this case, discussion on instinctual subtypes will be postponed.)

If you have a copy of Riso and Hudson's Wisdom of the Enneagram (1999), please read over the descriptions of the instinctual subtypes for your type and bring the book along if possible.


As a reminder, East-West now charges a $5 admission fee for the use of their space, exclusive of food purchased in the cafe. No outside food or drink is permitted.

East West Books
New York, NY, 10011

7 Yes
1 Maybe

May 6 7:00 PM

9 attended (est.) – No rating yet

Using the Enneagram in Concert with Other Systems

To what extent are there synergies between the Enneagram and other maps of type or of consciousness?

Inevitably, there are many other maps people use on the broad and subtle topic of variegated human nature. Particularly in our times, with information flying around at such great velocity, it is to be expected that many of us with our varying interests in the Enneagram will also be drawn to other systems of typology or forms of self-inquiry.

We may wonder how these systems seem to fit (or not to fit) together. Are the insights they offer us consistent with one another? Are they independent of one another - or do they tend toward some sort of correlation?

We will focus first on the systems that are most often-discussed in the contemporary Enneagram world as naturally offering combined synergies with the Enneagram (though there may be some debate on this point with regard to MBTI):


the "instinctual subtype" categorization (like the modern Enneagram, also due to Ichazo);
the Myers-Briggs system (or, MBTI - originally based on typological views of CG Jung).


We will also have open discussion on members' own interests in various systems of thought and how they may be combined with the Enneagram. Systems of personality typology (e.g., astrology - various traditions? - others?) will be considered along with more general systems of philosophical inquiry as regards conscious states (e.g., Ken Wilber's AQAL model).


Please join us! As a reminder, there will be a $5 admission fee charged by E-W (exclusive of food). Thanks.

East West Books
New York, NY, 10011

9 Yes
2 Maybe

Apr 1 7:00 PM

10 attended (est.) – 5.00 5.001

Dear Enneagram Meetup Members -

After a three month break (to explore an advanced Enneagram related topic), we are resuming our open group.

The next meeting will be the next first Wednesday, April 1, from 7 to 9 pm.

Our topic will be "Using the Enneagram in Community" - we will explore the role of feedback from knowledgeable fellow-seekers in first determining our Enneagram type and in exploring the implications of the expanded personal awareness that we may achieve through the system. We will have interactive discussion on members' own experiences getting feedback and in building community with others - versus simply reading and thinking about the Enneagram as solitary individuals.

A useful question to consider in advance - What would you like to receive from the development a more fully evolved Enneagram community (including this Meetup group)?

New members are particularly encouraged to attend this meeting.


Please note that E-W Books has recently started charing a $5 fee per person for their space. This is in addition to food purchased at the Cafe. E-W also asks that no outside food or drink be brought into their cafe.

Only members of this Group can view the location for this Meetup

6 Yes
3 Maybe